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Very psyched to see Anamanaguchi on this list. Pete (guy making it rain in the gif) is one of my close friends from high school, and played guitar with me in our high school band. He’s a fucking fantastic and incredibly sweet guy. I’ve also played music with their bass player James, who was a grade above us. Another great dude. They’re awesome to their fans.
Fuck shit up, anamanabros.
I kinda want him to lose again, cuz he’s a dickhole
You’re right, Kanye is a very under-appreciated artist
Obviously I don’t know anything more about his story than anyone else here, but the one thing I can say with a good deal of certainty is that he was likely repeatedly abjectly abused/raped himself as a child… that’s where this stuff comes from. Doesn’t make it at all excusable.
I’d like to just reiterate the goal of my original post was not to denigrate a belief system or way of life, but rather to present some moral, ethical and biological points in favor of reason and moderateness (both of which have been decidedly declared as hostile by an overzealous minority.)
1) “…the fewer creatures that I rob of their existence, the better.” Not much for any reasonable person to disagree with in that statement. As an aside, do you also feel this way about, say, mosquitoes and spiders? What about algae? I’m genuinely asking. Strict veganism seems to deal in absolutes, so it would seem again hypocritical to recognize the precious life of a dolphin but not an ixodes tick.
2) “Extraordinarily rare?” Veganism SHOULD be suspected in any case of macroovalocytosis or where the mean corpuscular volume of the red blood cell on peripheral smear exceeds 100. That’s just simple due diligence.
The following are abstracts, as I’ll assume you may not have access to subscription-based databases like medline, EBSCO host or other online physician references:
-A study stating vegan/vegetarian children are at increased risk for iron deficiency anemia, psychomotor impairment and B12 deficiency: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=7610022
-Three studies indicating vegans/vegetarians are at risk for B12 deficiency:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=12417096, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=11053901, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=18709879
-A study in which 10 of 25 vegans had B12 deficiency as indicated by macroovalocytosis and low cobalamin levels:
I’m not sure what enables you to say B12 deficiency, especially in vegans, is “extraordinarily rare?” Is it something you’re qualified to establish or something you just felt from personal experience?
I originally posted the stuff about B12 to illustrate that the consumption of B12, which is traditionally found exclusively in animals and animal products, is necessary, normal, and natural. This is not to rag on vegans, but it is to undermine anyone preaching otherwise (that aforementioned staunch minority.)
A militant vegan will always have an uphill fight because they’re pushing a radical position, while I’m merely suggesting a moderate one.
That’s all I have time for right now.
*Sigh.* I just posted a couple salient points that struck me while skimming the comments. Take ‘em or leave ‘em. I do appreciate these discussions but unfortunately I don’t have the time to respond properly to every thread.
For #1 – “Torture” is a really malleable term based on how you personally want to define it. I’d say some farms “torture” animals and some don’t, and that’s based on my personal feelings about what torture is.
For #2 – Thinking I care whether or not you eat meat, let alone thinking I’d try to convince you specifically what to do with your life, is presumptuous. I would never try to convert anyone from their beliefs because as long as what you do doesn’t affect me, I’m happy. Demonstrating the evolutionary importance of B12 shows that biologically, animal consumption is natural and healthy (I feel as though if I don’t state “WITHIN REASON,” obvious as this is, someone’s going to try and jump on it.) That was the point.
As far as the “we’ve been doing this all along” argument – this applies more to say, slavery than it does animal consumption. Again I just showed you that animal consumption is a biological necessity. That’s my perspective. Animals kill animals; that’s what happens in ecosystems. Killing an animal for the need, and for food, will never be moral dilemma to me. That’s my own personal feeling, you’re free to have your own. Of course I don’t want my food to be tortured in the process. You’d be a fool to argue this as anyone’s preference.
For #3 – It seems my meaning escaped you here. “Since we kill animals by mistake we should eat them anyway” was NOT my argument, so let me spell it out. Am I correct in my understanding from what’s been said on this board: to be “vegan,” you must consume nothing containing any animal products whatsoever, and you must avoid any product whose means of production met with animal harm of any kind, 100% of the time.
That about right?
The hypocrisy is that, when you eat “vegan,” animals are still dying. I see no way around that shy of planting, harvesting and cooking everything yourself. I’m not trying to belittle a way of life that doesn’t affect me, I’m just pointing this out. It seems to me this is something a vegan would have to reconcile.
And then the patronizing bullshit rant about 3rd grade science, waste disposal, self-sustaining systems, CO2 emissions, etc… Here’s a tip to avoid sounding sanctimonious when stating your ideas: treat your audience as if they are as educated, if not MORE educated, than you. In many cases they are very likely at least one of the two.
**sorry not fat soluble. Going on not a lot of hours of sleep here.
Couple random points to add:
“Most people who choose the vegan/vegetarian lifestyle not only do it for a healthier diet, but for moral/ethical reasons.”
Uhhhh eating vegan is not inherently more ethical than not. Sorry, everybody. Let’s be absolutely crystal clear on this.
1) If you’re vegan because you believe killing animals for food is wrong, you probably hold animal and human life as equal, in which case, this is your subjective moral belief. It doesn’t make you more moral or ethical than anyone else. This may come as a surprise to you nobody is in favor of torturing animals.
2) Human beings are evolved to consume animal protein. This is not up for debate. Don’t believe me? Vitamin B12 is a dietary essential fat soluble vitamin found ONLY in animal products, and it’s essential for a couple of the biochemical reactions in human metabolism. See here:
If the biochem is lost on you, you need B12 to make DNA. Without vitamin B12 stores you can get megaloblastic anemia and neurological symptoms, as occurs with long-term strict veganism. The fact that human beings do not MAKE this vitamin, but instead must CONSUME it (hence “dietary essential”) is evidence we evolved to consume animals.
3) If you farm, animals are going to die. They’re going to be displaced out of their habitats, they’re going to need to be dealt with when they eat crops, they’re going to be run over by farm machines, etc. Would you not eat a salad if you knew three rabbits were accidentally run over to get it to your table? If yes, how do you reconcile that? If no, what’s your solution?
+1 to Grimes. Veganism is a dietary choice. End of story. Do what makes you happy, everybody. If you wanna be a militant asshole, be a militant asshole. Stir up resentment among those with whom you supposedly share solidarity. It doesn’t affect me.
I know my truth
Ghostface does not disappoint.
Word is bond.
Zonoscope did have a pretty cool cover
I can get behind that.
And that is a strange, strange comment to make about another man, michael_
You know what’s a pretty good way to say “fuck Ian Cohen?” Never again read his reviews or visit sites he writes for.
I’m sure Cut Copy are a wonderful band and their mothers love them very much, but anybody gonna mention the elephant in the room, i.e. the late submission for worst album cover of 2013?
Spotify “hasn’t launched in [this] country yet.” Shame.
Aaaaaand now we all know why she named the new album…
Damn this fucking rocks. I was lucky enough to be at the Fallon show last time they were there, and then I saw them a week later at… Bowery Ballroom?
When you see these guys play it hits home how fucking awesome they are…
Lighten the fuck up, everybody.
Had to turn it off at the yodel.
*Original. <-that's my cue to sign off.
Also, author’s originally post duly noted. I liked it.
This ground has been thoroughly tread already above but I figure I should say something being that I was quoted in the original post.
No, I don’t think bands have to re-invent themselves and no, I don’t generally have problems with formula. Folks have mentioned some of their favorite bands on here who produce what could be described as formulaic music. One of mine is Bad Religion. But in any case when a band puts out a new album it sorta depends where on the spectrum they fall: did they literally copy and paste from the last album, or are they now nearly unrecognizable? This is all arguable.
Here’s my feelings on Best Coast:
1) I generally like the sonic aesthetic. Some of the melodies are catchy despite their simplicity and I appreciate that. Many are boring to me, or consist of chord progressions that I don’t find aurally pleasing.
2) Songs are too damn similar for my liking. It causes listener fatigue. If you like coming home to the same meal seven nights a week for three months because it’s comforting, that’s nice. (Although, okay, I’ll give you that best coast wrote a new number called “Fade Away,” which brings their grand total up to four songs.) I can’t help that my knee-jerk reaction to the new LP was boredom.
3) Best Coast’s lyrics are one of the most prominent elements of their music, and they’re also arguably the weakest, for a few reasons. I’m a student like a lot of you and don’t have time to root through youtube and lyrics sheets for bits I remember vaguely for the sake of an internet discussion, so let’s agree upon a few points.
-The lyrics and rhyme schemes are simplistic to a flaw. Sometimes words or phrases repeat over and over again with diminishing rather than magnifying impact.
-Best Coast songs are narratives. They’re little stories. I can’t give a shit about the narratives when the mood, tone and subject either a) contain the emotional sophistication of a fifteen-year-old’s English homework, or b) change dramatically in the middle of a song for no reason.
What am I talking about? Take “What They Want Me To Be.” you get about two minutes of an adolescent lament regarding familial expectations. Or whatever. The song title is self explanatory. Okay, it’s fucking endearing. Anyway in the middle of the song she switches to, “I want youuuuu, youuuuuu…” -wait what the fuck ? This is now another Best Coast boyfriend lament. Maybe this is invisible to some listeners but this utterly breaks the experience for me.
As a listener, I make some connection with the music, whether it’s instrumental, or more lyric focused (e.g. Hip Hop) or both. That’s what allows for enjoyment. Like I said, Best Coast IS a lyrics-focused band. Songs feel designed at times to support or propel the narrative. With all that I’ve mentioned about Best Coast there’s really little to none I can connect with as a 26 year old guy. The more I listen to Best Coast, the more it hits me in the gut like – wow, you are a 20-something stoner chick who does bong rips all day on the beach and waxes melancholy about your stoner boyfriend. That’s just not something I fuck with intellectually or emotionally. If you like Best Coast that’s cool, people like different things. I wouldn’t say I hate Best Coast. I like a minority of their stuff but otherwise they bore me.
This ended up being longer than I wanted.